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Unread 04-28-2010, 01:21 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by thedge View Post
So what features are supposedly being removed from the G4?
Brian,
The information should be available from your Link dealer. I do not want to make any specific comments about any of the Link products as I am not a dealer. I have been informed about the changes from my Vi-PEC distributor, so all that I'd prefer to say is that differences in both products are now in place.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 03:17 AM   #17
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Vi-PEC is a Link, essentially. Anyways, moving back to the vendor bashing...!

I'm thrilled I saw this thread because I've been controlling myself on all of those threads on rennlist time and time again. How about all the back ordered parts? Everything is back ordered or will most likely not be available again, so get it now while it lasts! It seems even the new products now offered are already limited order. Doesn't that sales tactic end sooner or later?

Yup, I feel better.

To be honest, though, a standalone is much more work than people are making it out to be. That is, in comparison to wiring in a MAF, plugging in a chip and fine tuning a SMT6. Can't argue that point. Is a standalone worth it? Oh yes. Easiest? No. And you can't say it's just simple 3k here or 2k there. Dyno time and tuning adds up as well.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 09:48 AM   #18
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Since I am the ‘old fart’ of the 951 standalone world I’ll throw out a few comments –

Of course I believe in standalone systems – but as a customer you need to know a couple of things –
Standalones are great for people that want to really get into tuning their engines.
Paying somebody else to really tune your standalone can run into some serious $. I had a customer drop of a 427 cobra with individual throttle bodies (2nd one I have done) that did not want to know anything about the standalone – he just wanted me to tune it from scratch and make it perfect – that cost about $2k. On the other hand I have had some 944 turbo customers that I gave a base start up file and a 10 minute phone call and they polished off the rest of the tune by themselves- easily.

The other thing that I always say about the standalone systems (sorry if you have to hear this again!) – Support is everything!! Once you get into the market for ‘real’ standalones the support can be more important than the bells and whistles. Following support come accuracy, then ‘robustness’ and last on the list is how ‘slick’ the interface looks.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 01:11 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by chris white View Post
The other thing that I always say about the standalone systems (sorry if you have to hear this again!) – Support is everything!! Once you get into the market for ‘real’ standalones the support can be more important than the bells and whistles. Following support come accuracy, then ‘robustness’ and last on the list is how ‘slick’ the interface looks.
I couldn't agree more. I don't believe the standalone option is for the person who just wants to turn the key and drive. Having to rely on the customer's tuning "specialist" can also become a problem (and cost more $) if they are not familiar with the tuning software or even tuning process. We have come across dyno "tuners" with limited mechanical skill who have spent many expensive dyno hours attempting to tune around an underlying mechanical issue.

I believe that "most" 951 owners interested in upgrading to a standalone system have a decent grasp or former experience of tweeking their tune with piggyback & laptop. Having said that, a thorough understanding of the tuning process, a firm grasp of navigating the tuning software and more importantly, recognizing how to apply the many powerful features that a standalone ECU offers are all key to sucessfully tuning your car.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 01:11 PM   #20
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i have heard of a couple other people using Wolf systems didnt know if anyone recommended those
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Unread 04-28-2010, 09:09 PM   #21
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^^N+O=NO^^

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Unread 04-28-2010, 09:25 PM   #22
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Lots of Audi guys (more across the pond) use VEMS. Don't know much about it personally.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 09:26 PM   #23
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^^N+O=NO^^

Well im years away from that decision so im guessing things might change a bit. No use in doing research now.
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Unread 04-28-2010, 09:31 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by alxdgr8 View Post
Lots of Audi guys (more across the pond) use VEMS. Don't know much about it personally.
There was something about being able to get support for it...or somethig along those lines.

I think Duke or Olli had some answers on it. Maybe they will chime in.
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Unread 04-29-2010, 12:25 AM   #25
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I just put a MoTeC on my 911. So much easier to tune than a piggyback on the 944. The piggyback keeps trying to run closed loop and then you have to tune far enough away to stop closed loop but then it still doesn't run right. So the only way the piggyback works is if I disconnect the O2 sensor. I hate piggybacks. I find it so much easier to tune a standalone.
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Unread 04-29-2010, 08:40 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Pauerman View Post
Brian,
The information should be available from your Link dealer. I do not want to make any specific comments about any of the Link products as I am not a dealer. I have been informed about the changes from my Vi-PEC distributor, so all that I'd prefer to say is that differences in both products are now in place.
Vic,

None of the changes you heard about took place and they may never take place. Right now, it is only a sales tactic to make a Vipec sound better than a Link. As of right now, you can still buy an Extreme with all the same functions as a Vipec. Link will make two models, one for Vipec and one for Link. They will still look similar and IF Link decides to make changes, they will have two units BUT both will be similar enough were there is no real difference.

For our purposes(944 turbo world) non of it really makes any difference to us. Especially when you can use the lowest model Link, The Atom, and its plug and play complete for $2400. It doesn't have all the bells and whistles but half or more of the people here won't use them, even if they had them.
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Unread 04-29-2010, 12:45 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by evil 944t View Post
Vic,

None of the changes you heard about took place and they may never take place. Right now, it is only a sales tactic to make a Vipec sound better than a Link. As of right now, you can still buy an Extreme with all the same functions as a Vipec. Link will make two models, one for Vipec and one for Link. They will still look similar and IF Link decides to make changes, they will have two units BUT both will be similar enough were there is no real difference.

For our purposes(944 turbo world) non of it really makes any difference to us. Especially when you can use the lowest model Link, The Atom, and its plug and play complete for $2400. It doesn't have all the bells and whistles but half or more of the people here won't use them, even if they had them.



Thanks for clarifying that there are no differences between the Vipec and the Extreme and that no functions or features are being removed from the Extreme.....

How many Links are installed and running that YOU have sold?
I am only asking because no one has posted any results of there installs?

-BB
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Unread 04-29-2010, 01:32 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckaroo Banzi View Post
Thanks for clarifying that there are no differences between the Vipec and the Extreme and that no functions or features are being removed from the Extreme.....

How many Links are installed and running that YOU have sold?
I am only asking because no one has posted any results of there installs?

-BB
I have one but its not installed yet
Michelle in Chicago is running one now (thread on Rennlist)
Duke has a Link, might be a G3 though
I think Corleone runs a Link on his crazy engine
DDP and Reno both have them but I think they are still installing them?
333pg333 in Aussieland runs a G4
Lots of other people.
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Unread 04-30-2010, 06:49 AM   #29
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I run a G3+. Corleone a G2.
And I have sold a G4 that I will be installing on a super nice 3.1l dry sumped machine.
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Unread 04-30-2010, 09:50 AM   #30
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BB,

I have 4 or 5 running. The funny thing is, all the RL'isters that have a G3/4 are all in the middle of projects and don't have them running yet. The others are track people that don't post on forums. On top of me, I'm friends with another 944 race shop that has a bunch of them running. So, they are very proven.
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